Tom McLaughlin

A former history teacher, Tom is a columnist who lives in Lovell, Maine. His column is published in Maine and New Hampshire newspapers and on numerous web sites. Email: tommclaughlin@fairpoint.net

Wednesday, January 16, 2013

Good Guys And Defiance

We want guns when seconds count and police are minutes away. Gun owners support police, but know they cannot be everywhere all the time, so we protect ourselves.

Gun buy-back programs don’t make the community safer. They’re feel-good programs for anti-gun people. Only law-abiding people are going to turn in guns. No bad guys will, so what’s the result? Not a safer community, because the number of bad guys with guns stays the same but there’s a net loss of potential good guys with them.
Bad guys aren’t going to register their guns either, nor will background checks stop them because they don’t buy their guns legally. Why would government want a registry of good guys with guns? So it can confiscate them should it decide to? We need armed good guys because Wayne Lapierre was absolutely right when he said: “The only thing that will stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun.”
Americans who protect themselves and Americans who support themselves are usually the same people. Also correlative are Americans content to depend on government for protection and those who depend on government for support. Used to be that most of us Americans were proud to take care of ourselves and our families against bad guys and proud to provide for all our own needs as well, but not anymore. The election last November 6th proved that America has changed fundamentally. I don’t like it, but I have to accept it.
If independent Americans depend on anything, it's networks of family and friends, and often church communities. Our Founding Fathers recognized that a nation of such individuals is much stronger than one in which people depend totally on government.

We want guns in case our government becomes tyrannical and tries to restrict our liberty. As America is becoming more politically polarized, and as government continues fueling anti-gun hysteria, we worry that its ultimate aim is to seize guns. If it comes to that, people are not going to sit  back and watch it happen.
A Texas lawmaker wants to jail federal officials who try to enforce new gun laws in that state. A Texas congressman is threatening the president with impeachment if he issues executive orders restricting guns. Former US Attorney General Ed Meese says it’s not far-fetched.
Wyoming is considering a bill that would nullify federal gun control measures under consideration by both the congress and the president and Wyoming’s governor thinks it will pass. The bill would also jail federal agents for up to five years who might try to enforce those measures. According to an article in the “The Daily Caller”: “It also contains broad language prohibiting any ‘public servant … or dealer selling any firearm in this state’ from enforcing ‘any act, law, statute, rule or regulation of the United States government relating to a personal firearm, firearm accessory or ammunition that is owned or manufactured commercially or privately in Wyoming and that remains exclusively within the borders of Wyoming.’”

But dissent in the hinterlands is not just about guns. There are nullification movements out there around a host of federal issues including domestic use of drones, Obamacare, the Patriot Act, and the National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA).
And it’s not just the right that is getting wary either. As the Democrats now controlling Washington, DC continue to consolidate power in the federal government, several other states are considering nullification bills on several issues. Tenth Amendment Center executive director Michael Boldin said recently: “A lot of people want to paint this as some kind of Republican movement to stop Obama. It’s not about party politics. It’s about freedom, liberty and controlling power. A wide coalition from left to right is supporting efforts to oppose indefinite detention in the NDAA. Heck, we expect four more states to consider weed legalization. Not exactly part of the Republican platform.” Boldin said. “It’s simple. Americans are saying, ‘We want to make decisions on issues at the local level. We don’t want mandates and dictates slammed down our throats from D.C. And we will not let the federal government spy on, grope and kidnap people with impunity.’”
Federal power has been growing for a long time under both Democrats and Republicans. Just re-elected is a president who believes redistribution of wealth by taking it from those who create it and giving it to those who don’t. As his policies drive America toward bankruptcy, lots of Americans get increasingly fearful of financial collapse and resulting societal breakdown. When that same president threatens expanded executive power to restrict the right to bear arms as he did last Monday, he’s playing with fire.
The Catholic Church is defying the Obamacare mandate. States are nullifying federal laws. People are frantically buying guns by the millions as he president threatens to restrict them. Will 2013 be the happy new year we all wished for each other a few weeks ago?

It’s not shaping up that way.

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53 Comments:

Blogger gaffer said...

This is not a gun problem, it is a people problem. Our society has been corrupted by progressive liberal ideas and laws. The result will not be pretty!

1/16/13, 9:21 AM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

No Gaffer, simply not true. That's what they want. Arguing over which side is to blame! No! It's called divide and conquer. This is no time to be divided,

Our society has been corrupted by a corporate fascist dictatorship. Nothing to do with liberals and conservatives---- that's partially why we are so screwed!

Obama must go. The corporate surveillance state has to end. We must all unite to overthrow this absurd govt.

I never thought that in my day I'd see another American revolution. But, it seems almost inevitable..

1/16/13, 9:55 AM  
Anonymous Truth Trooper said...

If you still think sandy hook actually happened, well, I have some ocean front to sell you in houlton.

Obamas press conference, flanked by children, calling for our guns...think there's a link to newtown? Gee,I wonder??

Time to wake up......they're coming

1/16/13, 10:05 AM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

Ive been railing about NDAA and fast and furious for months on this blog and you never have a response yet you now use a graphic using NDAA and mention fast and furious.

People love to try and ignore these truths until its too late.

Next Lie: Sandy Hook

1/16/13, 10:43 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

If you aren't physically ill after watching obamas press conference than you are already dead inside.

The shameless hubris using kids! Especially when you think of the number of kids he has murdered with drones!! Sick! Pure evil folks!

The fat lady is warming up....

1/16/13, 12:19 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Truth Trooper said:

"Obamas press conference, flanked by children, calling for our guns...think there's a link to newtown?"

OF COURSE there is a connection, Sherlock! Children were slaughtered and he now wants measures to help other children. If policemen were slaughtered I'm sure he would have had policemen on stage with him for the event.

If you were physically sick watching the event then you have real problems.

1/17/13, 12:02 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Since you are throwing around goofy stats that don't take other factors into account, here is another:

"In homes with guns, the homicide of a household member is almost 3 times more likely to occur than in homes without guns." - Johns Hopkins Center for Gun Policy and Research

1/17/13, 12:13 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Tom dodged this question in the past, but i'll toss it out again -

What well regulated militia does he consider himself part of?

1/17/13, 12:16 PM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

Anonymous ( may as well use the name spineless, huh? )

Uhm, it's called sarcasm....Sherlock.
And, it seems you are the only person on this planet to have seen evidence of a mass shooting? Wow. Good for you.
You believe everything you see on the magic box (tee vee)?? Appears so.

Yes, sheep, I am very outraged and offended when our president uses this supposed tragedy as means for an agenda. Sickening. ..and save your sanctimonious bs for the other half wits----- if Obama cared about children he'd stop murdering them with drones!! You pathetic obama zombies are truly evil hypocritical sheep.

No sir, you have the problem. Get over your ego and stop listening to mainstream media. Pathetic.

And guess what mr statistician? People who don't drive or ride in cars don't get in car accidents. Wow....go figure...

The facts are abundant. More guns equals less crime. Period.

1/17/13, 12:26 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'm glad that once again Tom is a minority opinion among Americans, who support a ban on assualt weapons.

1/17/13, 12:55 PM  
Anonymous Fred said...

Sarcastic Winston said:

"it seems you are the only person on this planet to have seen evidence of a mass shooting?"

Huh? What the heck is that supposed to mean? Are you referring to Sandy Hook? If so you are clearly not a rational human being, so let me know so I can ignore all future comments from you.

And I don't get "tee-vee" mr. sarcasm.

Get over your ego and stop believing any old conspiracy theory that nut jobs post on the web.

As for your childish name-calling, I would not even consider myself an Obama "fan", so get some facts before you post. But I see you do not care much about facts.

The "facts" ane NOT abundent about your "more guns, less crime" claim. If you bothered to research beyond finding what you want to believe and ignoring the rest, you would know that the John Lott book, which almost all this rubbish comes from, has now been debunked so many times that it's irresponsible to use it as though it proved anything. Lott admits that he didn't look at any other causative factors - no other variables, as they say. As one reviewer noted, the results are so odd that according to Lott's research, getting rid of black women older than 40 would do more to stop murder than anything else we could try - just one of several statistical absurdities.

So don't just jump to "period" before you educate yourself.

Another study to look at can be found at:

http://islandia.law.yale.edu/ayers/Ayres_Donohue_article.pdf

1/17/13, 3:27 PM  
Anonymous Rhonda said...

NONE of these gun controls would have prevented Sandy Hook, and they won't prevent another mass murder, because they are rules and regulations for the law abiding citizens. The criminals and crazies will always find a way to get the guns and ammo they want without taking safety classes, without giving a background check, and without paying the fees. Forcing gun controls on America's law abiding citizens doesn't make sense. When my doctor asks me if I own guns (I don't), I'm going to say "That is a question that the Obama admin is forcing you to ask me, therefore I refuse to answer because it is none of your *%#+ business".

1/17/13, 3:35 PM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

Lott? Whatever. I'm citing FBI statistics. Nice try.

You are the one believing a mass shooting took place, yet there is NO evidence. None. And I'm irrational? Wow..get a clue.

I don't care about facts? Wtf? I'm the only one utilizing them? Wake up, my god....

www.sandyhookhoax.com

I cheer prof james Tracy of FAU and his blog memoryholeblog.com addressing the many many inconsistencies and inlet media coverage.

It doesn't add up. At all. Until you do your OWN reseacrh of newtown you are just another corproate media lemming. The coverage of sandy hook was inexplicably bizarre, there are myriad inconsistencies. Crazy? Yeah, I know..and it scares me to death....

Not an Obama fan? Really? Ok......yup....

Until Barry stops drone murdering innocent women and children anything he says is irrelevant. Surrounding him self with kids while he has the blood of countless children from Yemen, Afghanistan, Iran and Iraq on his hands. If you condone this behavior then good luck. Maybe consider a long look in the mirror? I notice you failed to address that one, huh?

He should've been impeached for unconstituonal invasion of Libya! or fast and furious! Now he's citing trike a dictator and the yuppies love it!! Unreal!

Crucial thinking much? No, that's right, when confronted with disturbing truths you cry "conspiracy theory" wow, convenient....

1/17/13, 3:46 PM  
Anonymous Fred said...

Lott used FBI stats to try and prove his "more guns, less crime" claim. But, whatever, huh?

Go check out Fact Check to cut through the rhetoric:

http://factcheck.org/2012/12/gun-rhetoric-vs-gun-facts/


As for Sandy Hook, if 20 dead children and a town full of grieving parents and neighbors, and two surviving gun shot victems are not enough evidence for you, then go commit yourself. Look, you got your ass handed to you on the last thread on this subject, do we have to listen to your deranged babbling again?

You didn't answer last thread - why is EVERY big tragedy in the country some sort of conspiracy?

I'll tell you why. Because the kooks have fun with it. Adds something to their dull lives. And many gullibel people believe whatever they hear. "Hmmmm, it is not mainstream news, and it is all over the internet - must be true!"

And what did I say that led you to believe I was an Obama fan? Anyone that doesn't believe your nonsense must love Obama. Wake up, the world is more complex, it's not just one side or the other.

I am with you in one point. The USA has been taken over by corporations, and both political parties are pawns. Oh yeah, and drones suck. But I am not a lemming to the conspiracy nuts. I do my own independent research.

So unless some new evidence comes up about Sandy Hook that I have not seen or heard (and I have heard and seen all the goofy stuff ypou already pointed out) that gives the slightest hint of a conspiracy, then I am done with the subject.

But have fun with it - it's cheaper than going to the movies and provides endless entertainment!

1/18/13, 7:29 AM  
Anonymous John said...

Let's get back to the following fact: "In homes with guns, the homicide of a household member is almost 3 times more likely to occur than in homes without guns." - Johns Hopkins Center for Gun Policy and Research

Winston tried to make a goofy car analogy, but let's get real. How can you get around the fact that this shows that gunowners have a much greater tendency to commit homicide. And the study does NOT limit homicide to only shootings. Why are non gun owner homes commiting the same ammount of homicide with knives and other weapons? And how about this study:


For every time a gun in the home was used in a self-defense or legally justifiable shooting, there were four unintentional shootings, seven criminal assaults or homicides, and 11 attempted or completed suicides.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9715182

1/18/13, 8:17 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hmmmmm, suddenly Winston is basing his assumptions on numbers given by the feds. I thought he distrusted them. Why do I get the idea that if the numbers were different then he would be screaming about how they are all lies...

1/18/13, 8:20 AM  
Anonymous Fred said...

Another question that nobody had the guts to answer in the last thread:

Why should bombs, missiles, hand granades and other wmd's be banned? Are they not "arms"?

1/18/13, 8:25 AM  
Anonymous John said...

Ooops, my previous post should say "Why are non gun owner homes NOT commiting the same ammount of homicide with knives and other weapons?"

1/18/13, 8:28 AM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

Ass handed to me? Hahaha. Yup, ok....whatever lets you sleep at night..

I never said everything was conspiracy theory. You did.
Do you know the origin of the term? You should. This is exactly why it was created.
Since you did mention it. Gulf of Tonkin? Kinda got us into a war, remember? Well, it never happened. Fact. Gee, why would the corporate war machine lie? I don't know? gee? So, the precedent was set a long time ago. Remember the maine? Another lie...so.....

Anyway, if you did your own research on sandy hook and still believe the corproate media then good luck to you. You obviously lack critical thinking skills. I would be worried if I were you. Rather than highlight ALL of the glaring inconsistencies, and since you do your own research, memoryholeblog.com professor james Tracy's blog. A good start. This guy is taking serious heat from the corproate zombies because he has the gall to question the inept and embarrassing media coverage of the event. Cry conspiracy all you want. It doesn't change the facts and reality. If you've really done your own research and don't have serious questions then you are either a shill or lack critical thinking skills....the story makes NO sense to the thinking man. You want to align yourself with corproate medias account? Go right ahead, I would expect nothing less.....my god, the number of inconsistencies and high weirdness is astonishing really. And if you've already listened to and read prof. Tracy and the others ( sandyhookhoax.com) like the ct. Police officer Mann, who makes great points, then your mind is already made up...I have serious questions about your powers of perception if you are ok with the corporate media account...serious. So, instead do crying conspiracy how about get back to us and address all the points raised by Tracy and the videos at sandyhookhoax.com? I'll wait..I've put many many hours into researching this.

And gun statistics? As stated, we live in a corporately controlled world. They own all the media. So stats and figures mean nothing really. I defer to common sense and the constitution. Any American should be able to own a gun. Semi auto? Sure.

The media is complicit in covering the fact that ssri pills are a serious part of the problem. And, ct. Already had tougher gun legislation than the former federal ban!! it's not about the gun. It's about the shooter. Why have we not been given a motive? Why? all we hear is guns guns guns...and you wonder why a corproate fascist war machine wants its citizens to disarm? Study history much?



History is ripe with false fog events to further govt agendas. Wake up. This isn't shangra la.....

Instead of focusing on Lott or whatever else focus on the inconsistencies, lies and bizarre behavior. It's all right there in front of you. It's pretty pathetic and weak to state you've already seen and heard all the "conspiracy" theories regarding sandy hook when you obviously have NOT. Goofy? Hardly.....scary? Indeed...pure evil

1/18/13, 8:51 AM  
Anonymous Fred said...

You didn't say Sandy Hook was a conspiracy theory yet you babble on insinuating it is one. Talk about nitpicky. A conspiracy theory explains an event as being the result of an alleged plot by a covert group or organization - which is what you are doing. Cripes.

And ALL media is controlled and gives out purposful lies? What about a magazine like Rolling Stone that has been busting the government and corporations for decades. The exposes they have printed are astounding (and believable. Why are not people like them questioning Sandy Hook if it is so obvious to you. Small town newspapers exist everywhere, with no connection to "corporations", with reports who would love to break a story like that. Why nothing from them? Ah, so many questions you want to avoid.

It's about the shooter, not the gun. Ah, and it is about the pilot and not the atomic bomb. Which we all should be allowed to own....you know, in case the government attacks us, we do have the right to bear arms. Ooops, you want to avoid that too. Well regulated militia, anyone?

Anyway, don't you have more "fake" events to investigate - the moon landing? The holocaust? And you better go find out just what is happening under the airport in Denver.....

1/18/13, 10:43 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Here is a link to a site that debunks all the conspiracy theories point by point. Of course if your mind is made up without looking at all evidence, then skip it.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/16/sandy-hook-conspiracy-theory-video-debunked_n_2487427.html

Conspiracy theories surrounding the Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting have reached a new level with a viral "truther" video that has been viewed by millions of people in just one week. However, experts in conspiracy theory have debunked the video as a mere marketing trade on questions, not answers.

"The classic conspiracy theorist sees the hidden hand in everything. Nothing is as it seems," he added. "There's something bigger that's going on. They dont know where it is, but they are willing to tantalize people and throw out any number of suggestions, which are oftentimes contradictory."

David Mikkelson, founder of myth-bunking site Snopes.com, agrees.
"In any kind of disaster or tragedy like this, if you go through things with a fine-toothed comb, you will find a number of contradictory statements," Mikkelson told HuffPost. "Of course, most of them are cleared up within a few days of the initial reporting, but it's not something you're going to see in these [conspiracy] videos."
D.J. Grothe, president of the James Randi Educational Foundation, does note that truthers shouldn't be immediately dismissed as raving lunatics, however.

"Political conspiracy theorists are completely wrong [in their conclusions], but they're not crazy," he told HuffPost. "The leading conspiracy theorists ... are right on many of their initial factual claims. Depending on what the theory is, they might even be correct in all of their claims. Where they are wrong is connecting the dots that aren't there."
"We are hardwired to seek order in chaos, make meaning out of data noise, and it is paradoxically comforting to imagine that great tragedy is not just time and chance, but a function of some nefarious, pre-planned grand design," he added.

1/18/13, 11:15 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Unbelievable. Why can't simple common sense prevail?

Newtown CT, is a very small town of about 2,000 residents. This is slightly smaller than my little town of Madison, NH where my daughter went to elementary school. There is no way in hell that a fake massacre could have been staged at the school without the whole town knowing it was fake. Think it through, people!! We would know that town children did not really die. We would know that strange 'actors" have been put in our midst pretending to be parents. Yet, where are all the Newtown residents saying that this did not happen????? This whole thing is too asinine to comprehend. How can people be so incredibly naive and gullible??

I would not get so bothered if no one was getting hurt and foolish people were just wasting their time, but then I heard this:

"Shockingly, people are starting to believe Tracy's comments, and families who lost loved ones in the Newtown tragedy are getting hate mail and prank phone calls. One family was forced to take down an online memorial webpage when it was littered with hateful messages."

Unreal. These people make me sick.

1/18/13, 12:48 PM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

I don't need the corporate media to "debunk" conspiracy theories they are complicit in!! Hello!
Further, I don't need any explanation for what I saw and still see! Again, memoryholeblog.com. Read it.

You really have no clue about sandy hook. If you do have a clue, please enlighten us as to where that purple van went? Is it connected? And, at least attempt to answer why there is no evidence? One more time---- CCTV anyone? And yeah, standard practice to turn away emt's from a crime scene? Who needs them? And yes, it's normal for a grieving father to be chuckling ad laughing until he realizes the camera is on. Nothing wrong there robbie Parker. So, again, and this is the last time, sandyhookhoax and memoryholeblog. Took me hours, hours, to wade through all that info. How long did you spend? Listen to officer manns interview? Didn't think so. So when you've done the research and can argue each instance on your own rather then merely puppet corporate talking points get back to me. No more pasting quotes. Do you have any original thoughts on the issue? At least attempt your own debunking, which you have conveniently avoided.

Rolling stone? The music magazine that caters to niki minaj and lady gaga and bieber? Yeah, they dont have any corporate affiliation? hahaha..They stopped being independent a long time ago. Sure, Taibi is great. But you fail to see the limits of such reporting. They are controlled subversion. There are a handful of real journalists out there and they are silenced far to often.
Chris hedges comes to mind. Sued Obama over Ndaa. But you already knew that, right?


This is my favorite quote from your post: ""In any kind of disaster or tragedy like this, if you go through things with a fine-toothed comb, you will find a number of contradictory statements," Mikkelson told HuffPost. "Of course, most of them are cleared up within a few days of the initial reporting, but it's not something you're going to see in these [conspiracy] videos."

Really? Uhm one little problem with that. There is NOT one thing that has been "cleared up"!! What is he talking about? Where is the clarification? My god this is insulting! that is blatant lie! Laughable. This is what happens when you try and let the corporate media quotes speak for you. Stop cutting and patting and read the info out there am draw YOUR OWN conclusions.

Fred---What's your point about militia? I'm confused? You have full faith in govt? don't believe in tyranny ( I guess Ndaa and wiretapping aren't really happening?) the naïveté is staggering on your part. Our history isn't enough? Absolutely we should have the right to defend against tyranny. What is your point? And your analogy is again weak. It certainly is about the shooter. well, if you care about things like motive. It's more about ssri pills than guns!! Wake up. Or just keep suckling at the teet of corporate disinformation. Whose side are you on?

I wonder why the corporate media ignores the ssri issue? Hmmm. It's not like all the mass shooters were on them or anything, wait, they were.....and who wants to know why lanza committed this crime? That's not important. Guns guns guns....and by the way, lanza, who had to have reloaded many many times, never missed? Weighed down with all that gear? Not one miss? Wow..
And, again, please let us know how he got into the state of the art security schoolhouse?

And on and on and on

1/18/13, 12:59 PM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

Anonymous...James Tracy simply questions the mainstream media account. As he should because we have obviously been lied to. Why is it that free speech is suddenly wrong because the guy raises questions? It seems to me that it's fear..

It's not so much that it didn't happen, but that the accounts of what supposedly happened make NO sense. None.

It's amazing that you people are so quick to condemn.

Things simply don't add up. It's that simple. We have real questions that our media is ignoring!! That IS a problem.

Have you read Tracy's blog? Or do you just rely on others to read it for you? Come on....

1/18/13, 1:04 PM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

And we do have robbie Parkers video. The full version. I mean, this guy is laughing it up when someone off camera says "we're on" then he starts hyperventilating to change his demeanor!!!! I mean.....seriously! Grieving? Really?

Gene Rosen? That guy sends chills down my spine. Not only has his story changed, but this guy never thought to call 911? Are you kidding me? Sorry, that is bs...

The medical examiner? There aren't words for that display of unprofessional horseshit he tried to peddle. Clueless.

1/18/13, 1:09 PM  
Anonymous Ol Hickory said...

..."Attorney General Eric Holder and his Department of Justice have asked a federal court to indefinitely delay a lawsuit brought by watchdog group Judicial Watch. The lawsuit seeks the enforcement of open records requests relating to Operation Fast and Furious, as required by law.
Judicial Watch had filed, on June 22, 2012, a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request seeking all documents relating to Operation Fast and Furious and “specifically [a]ll records subject to the claim of executive privilege invoked by President Barack Obama on or about June 20, 2012.”
The administration has refused to comply with Judicial Watch’s FOIA request, and in mid-September the group filed a lawsuit challenging Holder’s denial. That lawsuit remains ongoing but within the past week President Barack Obama’s administration filed what’s called a “motion to stay” the suit. Such a motion is something that if granted would delay the lawsuit indefinitely.
Judicial Watch President Tom Fitton said that Holder’s and Obama’s desire to continually hide these Fast and Furious documents is “ironic” now that they’re so gung-ho on gun control. “It is beyond ironic that the Obama administration has initiated an anti-gun violence push as it seeking to keep secret key documents about its very own Fast and Furious gun walking scandal,” Fitton said in a statement. “Getting beyond the Obama administration’s smokescreen, this lawsuit is about a very simple principle: the public’s right to know the full truth about an egregious political scandal that led to the death of at least one American and countless others in Mexico. The American people are sick and tired of the Obama administration trying to rewrite FOIA law to protect this president and his appointees. Americans want answers about Fast and Furious killings and lies.”

I guess this is also a " conspiracy theory" because Brian Williams didn't tell you about it?

Or, those of you who worship Barry soetoro, how do you and king Barry sleep at night knowing you've murderd innocent women, chidlren and men around the globe with your drones? The gall to then surround yourself with children at a press conference is sickening and astonishing....Zelig heil

1/18/13, 1:21 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

ok Winston, you are beyond help. And you won't read or listen to anything that disputes the hogwash you are spewing because you don't like the source. (or more likely, don't like hearing the counter-arguements at all).

Perpetuating this crap like you do has led to the harrassment of grieving parents. How sickening can you get? Disgusting. I'm through with non-thinking, conspiracy gobbling sheep, so don't bother to respond. Unless unloading your BS is part of your therapy...

1/18/13, 1:35 PM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

What is your point here? You're confusing and don't know how to debate. I am the one who has spent hours and hours researching this stuff. Hours..you?

Your attmepts at attacking me fail miserably because you have no argument. You want me to listen to corporate whores regarding sandy hook? My god..what part of this don't you get----- I don't need anyone to tell me what I saw, see and experience. The facts are there.

And, funniest part is that you accuse me of ignoring anything that disputes my view! Haha. Uh, I have seen the corproate medias take. Hello!!! Nice try, trying to spin it like I'm the one ignoring info..unreal..

Last chance---- when you have something to actually post, an actual point, get back at us. Until you have studied all the info, and can DEBUNK EACH INCONSISTECY ON YOUR OWN your proving my point for me..you haven't addressed a single thing!!! You deflect with every post! Think for yourself much?

Your pathetic evasions of the disputed and documented problems with the mainstream media reports prove you have no idea what is going on..come on, please, address the issues, at least try. CCTV, second third shooters, purple van,..and on and on YOU HAVE NOTHING STOP TRYING TO ARGUE IF YOU CAN'T MAKE AN ARGUMENT!! What are you, twelve?

Who is non thinking?

Officer Mann? What's your take on the interview?

1/18/13, 1:58 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I hear a lot about conspiracies, but a conspiracy does not mean it did not happen. Mostly rhetorical nonsense, Winston just likes to rant. And I keep remembering the book where I first read the name 'Winston Smith'.

1/19/13, 10:39 AM  
Anonymous Huck Finn said...

Yes, it certainly seems Winston is caught up in his 1984 character's world. He is still rewriting history like his namesake. Very sad.

1/19/13, 12:11 PM  
Anonymous John said...

Still nobody has the cajones to try and explain why certain arms should be banned. The silence certainly blows their side of the argument away.

I know how Curt Schilling felt when he declared "There is nothing like shutting up 50,000 New Yorkers"

1/19/13, 12:18 PM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

Hey Huck, nice try, but no. You and the rest demonstrate what happens when the populous is a victim of newspeak.
The irony! Thank you!
You prove my point for me and the reason for the moniker I use.

War is peace
Freedom is slavery
Ignorance is strength

And 2 and 2 is 5

Have you ever read 1984?

1/19/13, 1:27 PM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

Anonymous,

"Anonymous1/19/13, 10:39 AM
I hear a lot about conspiracies, but a conspiracy does not mean it did not happen. Mostly rhetorical nonsense, Winston just likes to rant. And I keep remembering the book where I first read the name 'Winston Smith'.

Ignorance is strength, huh?

1/19/13, 1:43 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Rhonda,

Adam Lanza's mother was a law-abiding citizen, not a criminal. Better gun control could have prevented or lessened the number of deaths at Sandy Hook.

1/19/13, 4:18 PM  
Anonymous John said...

How about you, Winston? I know you think citizens have the right to bear arms, but what is your cut off? Granades? Bazookas? Missiles? Atomic bombs?

Tom is not man enough to answer, but will you? That is what this thread is about before you hijacked it once again with your conspiracy theories.

1/19/13, 4:19 PM  
Anonymous John said...

Good point about Adam Lanza's mother. It is very doubtful that this autistic kid gets his hands on an assault rifle if not via his law abiding mother.

1/19/13, 5:42 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yes, Tom answered that he thinks citizens should be able to own anything short of WMD's, but he had no answer as to why he decided that was the cut-off, or why wmd's should be banned.

1/19/13, 5:44 PM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

Rhonda, Connecticut already has tougher assault weapons legislation than the previous federal ban. No to mention the school zone gun laws.
This is all connected to what everyone here sees as conspiracy theory. The point is the media has dropped the ball. We have no idea about lanzas mother, really. How can we? First she was an employee at the school, then she wasn't. And , how do you explain the school nurse who stated that she worked at the school!! Unreal! We are truly in the dark here. The media has no integrity at all. It's gun guns guns guns. Not motive motive motive. What about the pills this kid was on? Relevant maybe??

I don't believe for a second a spindly aspergers kid with no real training, weighed down with a lot of gear, a lot, somehow entered a school with a brand new security system with no problem and evaded the CCTV cameras,
And never missed!? what? He would've had to reload many many times as well. And, suicide by assault rifle?
I believe that the initial reports of handguns makes a lot more sense. No to mention the long gun was pulled from the trunk.

John, your argument is silly and contrived.

I also don't buy the garbage about his mom being a "prepper". Not at all. A little too convenient.

1/19/13, 6:50 PM  
Anonymous John said...

Winston, you are so preoccupied with your conspiracy that you focus on nothing else. If you really can't answer the question about what arms to ban, and why, then man up and admit it. Why the evasion?

And if you think the kid would have gotten a hold of such a weapon without his mom, you just aren't thinking clearly. Blinded by a hatred and mistrust of government and "Big Brother".

1/19/13, 7:41 PM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

John, it's an asinine question really. But ok, how about let's keep it as it is. Works for me. That answer your question? The current gun laws in ct. were very strict already.
I'm not a victim of the campaign of fear. I have no idea what really happened at sandy hook or aurora? But I'm more afraid of ssri pills then assault weapons. The Virginia tech shooter used a 22 and a handgun. No assault weapon. And the body count was very high. It isn't the guns man.

As far as the kid goes--- like I said, we don't really know what happened because the reporting was so inept and misleading. And there is no reporting going on. All you hear is guns guns guns. I can't claim to have any knowledge of his mother? How could I? You all cry conspiracy yet fail to see there is no reporting going on. Unbelievable....

Mistrust of govt? Absolutely! By the way, govt is doublespeak for corporate state. Government? We haven't had a real govt in a long time. Corporate sellouts.
1913 rip the usa

1/19/13, 8:27 PM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

John how about answer these questions from my previous post?

How does a spindly aspergers kid with no real training, weighed down with a lot of gear, a lot, somehow enter a school with a brand new security system with no problem and evaded the CCTV cameras,
And never missed!? what? He would've had to reload many many times as well. And, suicide by assault rifle?
I believe that the initial reports of handguns makes a lot more sense.


You guys cry conspiracy yet never address any of the inconsistencies and misreporting. Convenient.

1/19/13, 8:34 PM  
Anonymous John said...

I agree with some of your points, Winston, but if the Virginia Tech shooter had an assault weapon it is hard to argue that the death count would not have been even higher. And if he had handgranades, even more. If he had a bomb, more still, etc, etc...

...which leads me yet agaoin to the question I have been asking over and over - where to draw the line. You have answered that you like it the way it is. ok. But WHY ban full out machine guns and more powerful weapons? I guess my point is, why shriek and scream at people who agree that people should have guns, but that assault weapons are going too far? It is just a matter of degrees we are talking, not "right" vs "wrong" and "good" vs "evil". The ugly rhetoric serves no purpose.

How did the kid do it? I think that was discussed last thread. He went in rigged up for quick reloading of his assault rifle. Where did you get your information on the weapons used, and why do you trust it? How can you argue that it COULD have been an assault rifle. We have no proof, one way or the other. But he possibly could have shot his way through the doorway and shot all those kids. And again, who say he never missed? Maybe, maybe not. And if you couldn't figure out how to kill yourself while holding an assault rifle, then I don't know waht to say.

I think we may have more in common than you think, but I believe you too dismissive of some possibilities.

1/19/13, 8:58 PM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

John, "where did you get your info on the weapons used, nd why do you trust it?" That has been my point all along! No, we don't really know because the reporting was terrible. NBC first reported two handguns used and a rifle in the trunk. Then it was an " assault weapon" and there was a shotgun in the trunk. This was all reported, repeatedly by all the networks. The narrative changed many times. Get it? why would someone want to change the weapons from pistols to an assault rifle? Gee, I wonder? Makes all the differemce in the world doesn't it?
That's how I can argue it "could" have been an assault rifle. A reporter even asked the medical examiner because that's what he was told.
What do you think he used? And why?

And I think you take a lot for granted here. Again, state of the art security. You had to be buzzed in apparently. He just shot his way in? really? I cant accept that. 911 wouldve been dialed immediatly. it wasnt...High tech surveillance, state of the art, where is the CCTV footage? Remember columbine footage? Where is it? Everyone skirts that one.
And this kid had no training and was on pills and weighed down, a lot. He would've had to reload many many times. No survivors? He shot and killed every target?


Suicide with a handgun makes a lot more sense doesn't it? And he was carrying at least one, right? So...???? Makes no sense. And why would you wear armor if your going to kill yourself?

There are so many more questions. So many.

1/19/13, 9:30 PM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

And, again, keep it as it is. Anyone can make a bomb. Oklahoma City? If someone wants grenade bad enough they'll get it, or make the equivalent. I'm not worried about. Why are you? Again, I'm more scared of ssri pills and big pharma, and GMO food than assault weapons and missiles.

And the Virginia tech shooter could've made a car bomb and drove into a mall? or aliens may attack tomorrow? It makes no sense to speculate. Again , oklahoma, homemade bomb.If someone wants to kill people they will. Why not focus on why? huh? Motive? Rather than take the guns take the guns oh my god!! The guns!! How about the pills the pills! Why are all these shooters on ssri pills??!! And why does the media ignore it? That's far more important than guns.

It's a campaign of fear as far as terrorism goes. But the reality is there ARE cameras on every street. We CAN be wiretapped at will. Habeus corpus is gone. american citizens are murdered with drones with no due process. Bankers get bailed out rather than jailed and we get the shaft. And they WANT our guns. Connect the dots.. It IS 1984. Or 1930's Germany... ( but I guess that's all conspiracy, huh?)

1/19/13, 9:41 PM  
Anonymous Johm said...

Winston, a disturbed young man broke his way into a school (my daughters school is also "saate of the art/double door/buzz in system, and believe me, it would be easy to shoot your way in). Everything I hear about this seems "possible", and more plausible then other possibilities people are bandering about on the internet. The world is a better place than you think. I feel sorry for you.

Cheers

1/19/13, 10:15 PM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

These are essential questions John. Essential.
And again, CCTV footage? Plausible? Not really.
And why didn't anyone see him approach? Plausible? not really. And why no 911 call when he shot the door? Not plausible in my book.
This is crucial info John.
Feel sorry for me all you want.
I feel sorry for us all.

Do you realize the scope of how botched the story is? Seriously.

Nicely done, avoid that CCTV question again.
And the 911 call?

And the importance made of his using an assault rifle as opposed to the pistols originally and widely reported is extremely important. Extremely.

I don't claim to know anything about what happened. Still piecing it together. I just want someone answers to simple questions. That makes me crazy? What has this country come to?

Really, the biggest conspiracy theory is the mainstream medias account.

1/19/13, 10:38 PM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

And those ssri pills and motive don't matter? Seriously?
Motive. Eh, who cares? Pills? what pills?


You don't think this is important?

1/19/13, 10:43 PM  
Anonymous jimmystaver@gmail.com said...

Professor james Tracy defends his point of view, and free speech.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/were-crisis-actors-used-in-sandy-hook-massacre.html


Interesting and informative if you want some real perspective on newtown.

But you already know all the facts right?

1/20/13, 8:33 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Too much. I think you read 1984 at a very impressionable age and you still can't separate reality from your Winston character. Please try and stay on topic.

1/20/13, 9:04 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

If ignorance is strength Winston,you must be Superman.

1/20/13, 9:29 AM  
Anonymous Winston Smith said...

.."“Conspiracy theory” is a term that at once strikes fear and anxiety in the hearts of most every public figure, particularly journalists and academics. Since the 1960s the label has become a disciplinary device that has been overwhelmingly effective in defining certain events off limits to inquiry or debate. Especially in the United States raising legitimate questions about dubious official narratives destined to inform public opinion (and thereby public policy) is a major thought crime that must be cauterized from the public psyche at all costs.


Conspiracy theory’s acutely negative connotations may be traced to liberal historian Richard Hofstadter’s well-known fusillades against the “New Right.” Yet it was the Central Intelligence Agency that likely played the greatest role in effectively “weaponizing” the term. In the groundswell of public skepticism toward the Warren Commission’s findings on the assassination of President John F. Kennedy, the CIA sent a detailed directive to all of its bureaus. Titled “Countering Criticism of the Warren Commission Report,” the dispatch played a definitive role in making the “conspiracy theory” term a weapon to be wielded against almost any individual or group calling the government’s increasingly clandestine programs and activities into question..."

memoryholeblog.com

Anonymous/ spineless, I think there's a pasture missing some sheep?

1/20/13, 5:33 PM  
Anonymous Mike Ike said...

Winston--- don't let the b&$@)$&@ drag you down!
These reactions to your posts come directly from fear.
They will wake up eventually. Turning off the television would be a great start.

I wanted to post something I found regarding chemtrails/ geo- engineering. This is unbelievable and scary as heck!
These scum are poisoning us and finally are being taken to task with lawsuits.

http://mohavecountyconstitution.com/pics/mstandard.pdf

This is beyond nuts. I bring this up here because I figure most folks reading this site probably have never heard of chemtrails. If they have, they've written it off as " conspiracy". Couldn't be further from the truth. The proof is abundant.

This is happening. If you enjoy breathing, you may want to start paying attention.

1/20/13, 5:44 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

No, Winston, the term "conspiracy theory" became "weaponized" because of wackos believing that:

* The holocaust was not real
*The moonlanding was a hoax
* The government has captured aliens
*Walt Disney and Hitler are one and the same
*Sandy Hook was staged

And so on and so on. You sound like Lance Armstrong objecting to the word "dishonest".

Aren't there lots of sites you can go talk about this stuff with other nuts? Do you have to hijack every thread, no matter the topic, with your rants.

1/22/13, 10:35 AM  

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